[This digest is the copyright of the Move "Useless Information" Mailing List. Re-publication or re-distribution of "Useless Information" content, in any form whatsoever, is expressly prohibited without prior written consent.] USELESS INFORMATION The Move Mailing List Digest Issue #446 February 18, 2003 In this issue: * A 'Woodless' Move (cont.) * The Move Part 2? * Woodless in Manhattan * "Check out Outstanding Collection at Amazon.co.uk" (cont.) * An open letter to Roy with love... * Center of The Move Universe? * ELO2 info on Face The Music Online ============================================================== To POST TO THE LIST: Send an e-mail to: move-list@eskimo.com Move List Info & Archives: http://www.eskimo.com/~noanswer/movelist.html TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail to move-digest-request@eskimo.com with the word "unsubscribe" (no quotes) in the subject line ============================================================== Subject: Re: A 'Woodless' Move Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 15:15:55 -0800 From: "David Woodier" Quoting Bev Bevan: >Roy has made it pretty plain that he is not interested in re-forming >the 'Move'. He's also shown no objection to a re-formation of the >band without him. I'd be genuinely interested in what everyone who logs >on to 'useless information' thinks about this. Would you attend a >'Woodless' Move performance? Roy was the 'Move'. That is, without him and his talents (particularly writing catchy pop-songs) they would not have been as successful, if successful at all. Yes they all have/had their own talents but Roy's was the strongest to work for the group. Roy has only had commercial success with his pop songs. Look at Looking On, Shazam, SAW (and Main Street recently) all released when Roy was in the public eye, but they did not chart and probably did not sell that well. His other 'poppier' outings i.e. OTRA and Starting Up were released when he was not 'active' and were probably poorly marketed. Brew was not what the public expected after Ball Park & Jive. Eddy did better in the UK charts and the 'Move' was the only Move album to chart. Both POP. Therefore If the Move members did re-form without Roy, good luck to them but they should not use the Move name out of loyalty to Roy. If anyone saw an advert for the Move I would expect that 90% of the UK general music public would only know Roy as being in the Band and would therefore expect him to be playing. Another name for them fine! It is no different that the album recorded by Rick and others - 'Bathe Your Feet?' if that had been released as Wizzard, without Roy's involvement another mark against his name in what has already been a roller coaster of a career. All I would want from Roy (if nothing else) would be for a release of new material. He is a vastly underrated musician and songwriter, his talents should not go unheard, especially as it is now 17 odd years since any official new stuff (Lion's Heart excepted). Think I wandered slightly off theme there but hopefully you get the gist? ********** Subject: The Move Part 2? Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:29:13 -0800 From: kakman1 In regards to any reformation of The Move, with or without Roy Wood, there isn't going to be any messy legalities and bickering like there was with ELO Part 2, is there? That would be almost kill the idea dead in the water, 'cos I'm sure Bev would not want to ever go through that nonsense ever again. Kevin Kunreuther Dallas TX ********** Subject: Re: A 'Woodless' Move Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 15:16:31 -0800 From: Richard Messum Bev asked: >Would you attend a 'Woodless' Move performance? The quick answer, is, no. The extended version, is, as i live 'way out in the boonies and don't drive, i would be delighted to attend a "Woodless" Move performance if they were appearing in my town, at a venue that was within walking or taxicabbing distance. But i would be unwilling to take the train trip to the nearest big city and stay overnight (as there would be no train home after the gig) (the train service here is atrocious, it really is....) to see them. A "Wood-ful" Move performance, well, now, that would be an entirely 'nother story! ********** Subject: Re: A 'Woodless' Move Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 18:28:44 -0800 From: "Tyler C.Sherman" The Move without Roy Wood would be like decaffeinated coffee or alcohol free beer. The "kick" that makes it what it is would be missing. It might look similar, taste similar, but the major ingredient would be missing. It would be akin to a Jeff Lynne-less ELO, which Bev did put on the road and apparently he would be willing to do the same with The Move.. To be honest, that never got me interested enough to buy the CD's ELO Pt.II made or go to any of their shows. I expect I would react much the same to a Move without Roy. Wizzards, Tyler ********** Subject: Move sans Roy Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 21:14:01 -0800 From: Poisongold Hmmm...well, if they came to NYC I might see them once, out of curiosity, but I really wouldn't consider them The Move without Roy Wood. The whole band simply revolved around Roy. I guess they could be "The Move Part II." Why bother, though? If it's Carl Wayne and Bev Bevan wanting to play together again, why not start a new band with a new name and throw in some Move covers? There's no way to bring back the past. That's my op, anyway. MJC ********** Subject: Re: A 'Woodless' Move Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 21:59:51 -0800 From: "Richard Pasquini" Hi all, I would not be interested in a Woodless Move. Plain and simple...it wouldn't be The Move. He wrote all the original material. The Kinks wouldn't be the Kinks without Ray or Dave Davies. They both toured on their own, Dave with a band and they didn't use the name, The Kinks. You need Ray and Dave for The Kinks. You NEED ROY WOOD FOR IT TO BE THE MOVE. It would be great if the others got together. I would buy there product because I like all of there talents and music...but still, it would not be THE MOVE Thank you....Rich ********** Subject: Woodless in Manhattan Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 21:13:51 -0800 From: Plastic Ono Dream oh no "tyler"..."bev" wouldn't do a "move part 2"...would he ? i hope he's learned his lesson! uh oh...is "bev" reading this? just kiddin' buddy! man, i'll help book a "woodless move" into "the village underground" or "the bottom line" or "b.b. king's" here in new york (where we're having a roy wood's blizzard at the moment) in a minute! but you'd have to call it "a night of move music featuring original members" or something. it would (no pun) still be an incredible show! too bad former "move" members just can't join "roy wood's army"...what a supergroup that would be huh? anyway, i'm headed back to "crazy jeans" when i get outta work, & though "martin kinch" is certainly to be trusted, i still don't think it's "roy wood" on lead voice...but it could be! and thanks for your concern "kevin kakaman", i'll sleep fine here in new york city, as long as i'm not in texas when i wake up! have a great week everybody, from terrorist-alerted, peace demonstrated,freezing snowy new york city u.s.a.! ********** Subject: Re: "Check out Outstanding Collection at Amazon.co.uk" Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:51:24 -0800 From: Rob Caiger > Rob - Now when you say the WB tapes are still in Burbank, i presume > you mean the post Eddie And The Falcons tapes. You already have the > Eddie tapes by what you have written on list right? On The Road Again and Superactive Wizzo. Eddie was recorded for EMI (originally) so we found the tapes in Universal's old Polygram archive! Figures.... They are now back with EMI. ********** Subject: Re: "Check out Outstanding Collection at Amazon.co.uk" Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:29:10 -0800 From: "Andrew Footman" Rob Caiger wrote: >On The Road Again and Superactive Wizzo. Eddie was recorded for EMI >(originally) so we found the tapes in Universal's old Polygram >archive! Figures.... They are now back with EMI. Well why has Roy never bothered to recover this stuff? I sometimes think the man left his brains on a train. Gods sake give the man a kick, get him to see sense. I sometimes wonder if he understands the importance of his own work. Blimey he is a fantastic writer of songs and he has all but let them become lost. The man is mad, he could reform the Move, Wizzard or ELO and storm America. The world would sit up and take notice of this. Any of these bands would stand up on the stadium arena. God sake the Roundhouse and Robin Hood are not what this man should be playing. He should look at getting himself and his music back out there by the great bands reforming. OK they are not the best of mates but i've been there myself. Bands never really get on just play and keep Carl in the middle. Christ you dont need to fall out, not after all these years. You are lucky that you are all alive and well. Use your loaf and make some money, if not for yourselves than the brum kids hospital. ********** Subject: Re: "Check out Outstanding Collection at Amazon.co.uk" Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:04:16 -0800 From: kakman1 Ok Andy, let's not dump all over Roy now, because he let SAW and OTRA fall by the wayside. Let's look at the reality of the situation. At the time of their release each album did shall we say less than poorly saleswise. The far superior Main Street (ghastly CD artwork aside) was shelved for twenty five years and was finally released to less than mediocre sales in UK. Whether one attributes the fault of any of these albums to chart to poor promotion, no tour or live appearance, etcetera, nevertheless the public failure of these releases may not inspire Roy to think much of them. Also, until recent years, for much of his career, his business affairs have pretty much been in other people's hands and he may have felt pretty powerless and or lazy about recovering his lost catalogue. He may figure, "What's the point? They didn't sell the first time. And I still get royalty my checks from my other stuff." If there was a significant interest in these items from his past catalogue, perhaps he would think differently. We should thankful that Rob is cobbling something together for us devout devotees for the near future. As for re-grouping the Move, just stop and think about one little thing for a sec here. Who would be the leader of the group if they got together? That was one source of their many squabbles. In the beginning in the pre-Secunda Mod-days, when they were youg 'uns, Carl was the de facto leader and front man, he had a van and the P.A. equipment, organised the bookings, was more responsable and made sure everyone got to the gig and everyone was paid; as they became more succesful and other people began managing their affairs and their image for that matter, squabbles ensued. Carl may have been the focus visually still as front man, but Roy was the one writing all the songs and getting the band the hits. Ace and Trevor both felt their influence and contributions diminishing. Bev tend to side with Carl and Roy. Bad feelings all around. Roy vowed he'd never get in such a situation again (one reason he ledt ELO remember, when Jeff and Roy began squabbling in the studio and on the road). If Roy got together again with his old bandmates, who would call the shots? Would all the old clashes ensue or rise to the surface again? I do not think Roy would not want to find out. Time may have healed a lot of wounds but I do not think Roy would want relive what to him was a lot of unpleasant memories. Anyway, there is a new release coming very soon that I think will satisfy you Andy that does involve Roy and Carl, and I do not mean ELO II re-master. As for a Wizzard re-union, isn't Roy's Army/Big Band enough? Aside from seeing a few videos from TOTP on a glam video I found at Walmart some time ago, I've never seen Wizzard live myself. If I want to see a band in face paint live there's always KISS or Insane Clown Posse ;o) Kevin Kunreuther Dallas TX ********** Subject: Re: "Check out Outstanding Collection at Amazon.co.uk" Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:15:24 -0800 From: "Tyler C.Sherman" You're onto something there, Andy. It has always puzzled me why Roy has so steadfastly refused to consider the importance of his own past achievements, and to entertain the possibility of working again with The Move or Wizzard. Especially The Move, which have a legendary rep over here in the states and people here might actually be more receptive of them now. I know Roy likes to keep moving (no pun intended) forward and considers reactivating either band to a step backward. That's not really the case here though. It's really more like unfinished business. Both bands could have achieved more than they did. Just as The Move were starting to make an impression here in the USA, they morphed into ELO. Had they continued on for a while longer with another album and tour, I'm sure they would have finally hit big here. Likewise, Wizzard were set to do another tour here but that got the kabosh and then they broke up. And things kind of spiraled down from there. He's continued to make great records, as a solo and with various groups , but these two bands, most notably The Move, are his greatest achievements and they could have done so much more....and hopefully someday he will see this and not consider it '' retread" to take up where they left off. Come to think of it, Frank Zappa had a similar attitude toward his past work. He considered it to be just pieces of plastic melting in the sun. In fact, he did eventually get involved with reissues of some of his early stuff and he changed things so much they bore little resemblance to the original works. So maybe it's good that Roy's not too involved! Anyway, I hope Rob does get Roy's co-operation with these great works he's trying to do justice to and that eventually Roy will "see the light" and seriously consider reforming the Move someday while they are all still with us. Wizzards, Tyler ********** Subject: An open letter to Roy with love... Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 21:59:57 -0800 From: wallysweb I feel deep down that it would be a mistake for Bev & co. to do a "Roy-less" Move. But I feel now that this is the perfect time for me to vent an opinion that I have harboured for a very long time!! First off I love Mr. Roy Wood with a real passion. I am 33 years old now and he has been an influence and a major part of my life for well over 2 decades...BUT...ROY WOOD IS A SAD PASTICHE OF A ONCE GENIUS SONGWRITER!!!!!! A man who is so loved and respected but...A. Goes on sad BBC cookery programmes instead of releasing a new record. B. Embarrassingly comes out once a year to play "One" song on the WORST TV programmes imaginable. C. Clearly does not bother his arse helping true friends like Rob re-claim his great work (and being a songwriter myself - this is SACRILEGE!!!!). D. When he does play it's with at least half a dozen people too many and at church fetes or beer festivals. D. When and if he's interviewed it will be completely one-dimensional and lacking in any insight. E. Almost single handedly sullied the wondrous joy that is IWICBCE by "Blending" it into a Wombles song. Oh God this man is worth so much more ...somebody please tell him!!!!! I really say this with a tear in my eye for I love and respect him SO MUCH. But come on fellow list members it has to be said!!!!! WE ALL FEEL IT IN OUR HEART OF HEARTS!!!!! I know for a fact that Roy is two or three phone-calls away from working with some of the most influential and much respected people in music today, they would kill for the chance to help him out and play and record with him. Does he actually know this Rob!!!!!????? I mean actually listen and take it in or does he bury his head for ten months of the year and wait to hear the cash registers ringing in November?? If history says Roy Wood's last L.P to be "Starting Up" then Roy deserves all the shit that will get thrown at him. And anyone who defends this record answer me this...If Rob said we could have only one more Roy re-issue but he had found master tapes to two albums (Starting up & Boulders) and we had to choose one...The landslide would be bigger than Saddam Hussein's!!!!!!!! Leaving his loving and devoted fans with that record as his last is offensive and criminal. Please Roy help Rob and talk to the fans.....it would mean so much ..Love - Thomas. ********** Subject: Re: An open letter to Roy with love... Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:09:40 -0800 From: "George Mackenzie" I agree with Thomas in a certain way, however maybe Roy is happy doing what he is doing. only"working" 2 months a year making more money in that short period than I'm probably making in a year, but I do feel that Roy should reward his loyal fans with something new. I know he doesn't have a recording contract at the moment, but I'm sure he's got enough material to release at least 3 albums. Why doesn't he do something just for the fans, even a couple of songs on a mini CD, which would only be available through the fan club. At least it would keep everyone happy for a while. Bye the way keep up the good work Rob. ********** Subject: Center of The Move Universe? Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:03:50 -0800 From: kakman1 There's a common thread that's running through some posts about the possible Wood-less reformation of The Move and Poisongold seemed to underline that feeling by stating The Move revolved around Roy Wood. From what I have read (and GAWD that's an awful lot) The Move were known from 1966-1970 as live unit and a hit machine in the charts. While Roy was certainly writing the songs, for the press and the fans that came to see the band perform, a lot of the focus was on Carl Wayne, especially after the exits of Trevor Burton and Chris Kefford. Roy started getting more prominence when he sang lead on hits such as "Fire Brigade" and "Blackberry Way", but was satisfied that Carl beared the brunt of attention on stage and in the press. Only after Carl's departure and The Move's TOTP appearance for "Brontosaurus" did Roy become the focal point for The Move and the nascent ELO, and then a true full fledged pop star in his own right as a solo artist and as the center of the multi-hued hailstorm that was Wizzard. Kevin Kunreuther Dallas TX ********** Subject: ELO2 info on Face The Music Online Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:55:28 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins http://www.ftmusic.com Follow the Here Is The News link to more info about the upcoming 30th anniversary limited edition ELO2 2CD (with bonus disc!) For Move fans, you'll want to know about Roy and Carl's involvement on this release. Sound files will be available soon, along with lots more info. Didn't Carl reveal in a TV interview a couple years back that he wished he'd followed Roy on to the Electric Light Orchestra project? Does anyone remember this interview? (Lynnette, I think you know the one I'm referring to... Roy and Carl were sitting next to each other on barstools and sharing some "true confessions" of sorts...) ********** Subject: Re: ELO2 info on Face The Music Online Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 17:15:52 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins >Didn't Carl reveal in a TV interview a couple years back that he >wished >he'd followed Roy on to the Electric Light Orchestra >project? Does anyone >remember this interview? Ha! I remembered, so now I can answer my own question. The interview was actually a 30-minute documentary that aired on Carlton TV back in July 1998. It was part of Carlton's "Now & Then" series. I remembered a Joe Ramsey post about this show so I dug a few of his comments out of the Move List archives... "Roy Wood and Carl Wayne performing 'Flowers In The Rain'... together... recently! Very, very cool!! A British documentary on Roy's career called "Now & Then." An interviewer travels with Roy to all of his Birmingham haunts and questions him about his career. Highlights: Roy having his hair colored by long-time stylist. Roy and Carl Wayne being interviewed about the Move at Roy's favorite musical instrument shop. Carl Wayne comes off as a very intelligent, affable fellow. He talks with great modesty about wanting to be a Tom Jones-type which probably was the beginning of the end for The Move. He describes Roy as being an incredible creator. AND... attention ELO and Jeff Lynne fans, he talks about Roy proposing ending The Move and starting The Electric Light Orchestra as far back as "Fire Brigade" time. There was a bit of sadness in Wayne's voice as he says that he now wished that he would have trusted Wood's creative instincts. Roy also says that he and Wayne are still great friends and, I think possibly embarrassing Carl a bit, admits that he is four years younger than Wayne. Great stuff." ---- It's hard to imagine, now, what ELO would have been like with Carl in the band. But according to this interview, it could have happened, if only Carl had said "yes." However, when Roy left ELO to form Wizzard, would Carl have stayed with Jeff and ELO, or would he have joined Wizzard? Imagine Carl and Bob Brady singing together...! ********** Subject: Re: ELO2 info on Face The Music Online Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 01:48:52 -0800 From: "Lynnette Cannell" > (Lynnette, I think you know the one I'm referring to... Roy and Carl > were sitting next to each other on barstools and sharing some "true > confessions" of sorts...) Yes, I've got it on video somewhere - cant remember the name of the programme, but it was hosted by Jim Bowen - a sort of "Life of Roy Wood" programme. This is how I knew that Carl was the "oldest friend" referred to in a previous post - Roy used to go into the greengrocer's owned by Carl's mum - where Carl would pelt him with peas from his peashooter! I think they were sat next to each other in a music shop............... As Im writing anyway, my thoughts on a Move without Roy - how on earth could it be the Move? He and Bev were the only ones there through all incarnations and line ups, he wrote the songs, and latterly sang most of them. Sorry, but for me this could NEVER be the Move. I would love to see a "one-off", maybe a benefit show, where they all got back together, and think this is the only way Roy would ever consider it, perhaps if all the others persuaded him? (and maybe for such a one-off, even Trevor could be persuaded to play Blackberry Way!!) He wouldnt want to get back together for touring etc., he obviously has other ideas, although knowing how lazy he can be, whether any of them will ever get off the ground, who knows? Lets face it, he is (as am I!) getting on a bit, clearly enjoys his lifestyle, and must have enough money to keep him going. Criticising him for not doing more is hardly fair, is it? Why shouldnt he be doing what he wants, even if we would prefer to see more? Goodness knows, if I had enough money to have a nice house, car, lifestyle, I dont think I'd be going into school any more - I'd be doing the things I wanted to do...................... On the other hand, if anyone ever does persuade him - I'll be in the front row at every gig! End of Useless Information #446 ******************************* [This digest is the copyright of the Move "Useless Information" Mailing List. 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