"RobertJasiek","Rules at Olympics Close to Ikeda","2008-06-20 16:47:14","There is no established interpretation of the World Mind Sports Games 2008 Rules of Play yet but it is possible that the essential core is meant to equal Ikeda Area III Rules and Ikeda Territory I Rules. For theory and further comments see the rec.games.go thread \ \ Relation between WMSG Rules of Play and Ikeda Rules \ \ Note that tiny changes in the interpretation of the official rules' wording can lead to grave misinterpretations. So read the rules with great care and wait for official explanations as well. \ Currently my relation of WMSG Rules to Ikeda relies on just one semi-official source via private email and the relation is actually already my interpretation again. Can anyone confirm the theory? \ \ The rules: \ \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGrules.pdf[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGrules1.pdf[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGrules2.pdf[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGrules3.pdf[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGregulations.pdf[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGpair.pdf[/url] \ \ (These links may be temporary because of the file sizes. So if you want to download, do so now. These informations have been distributed to (some) WMSG participants. It is not out of the question that revised versions might appear later. Anyway it is good to be information at least some months before the event. This policy is clearly above average.) \ \ Strategy (Ikeda T1): \ \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/rules.html[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/ikeda.html[/url]" "John Fairbairn","","2008-06-21 02:53:16","[quote]Note that tiny changes in the interpretation of the official rules' wording can lead to grave misinterpretations. [/quote] \ \ This applies to the heading of this thread,too. I'm not certain, but I had the impression that the WMS event has nothing to do with the Olympics except proximity. Does anyone know whether there is a connection?" "RobertJasiek","","2008-06-21 04:24:06","I wrote \"Olympics\" in the thread title for the practical purpose of avoiding a too lengthy subject by using the phrase \"World Mind Sports Games\". The resulting lengthy title would have been inappropriately long for this forum's GUI. Using the abbreviations WMSG instead might have been understood by too few readers. Hopefully this ends the meta-discussion." "Bill Spight","","2008-06-21 06:39:53","Yes, I think that the intent is to make rules like Ikeda's, or like Button Go. And I think that if White makes the first pass, Black gets one point deducted from her score. The wording is rather clumsy and ungrammatical, however, and the word is \"reduced\", not \"deducted\". \ \ [QUOTE]There are two types of compensations. The first is based on the principle of equal number of plays. If a player first makes a pass at the end of the game, his opponent will have made the last play. If White makes the last play, the numbers of plays are equal, and no compensation is needed. If Black makes the last play, then the point made from the play will be shared equally by Black and White. This is accomplished by requiring Black’s points be deducted by 1 point.[/QUOTE] \ \ I am a bit concerned about finding a play after two passes. \ \ [QUOTE]3. The reason and aim of resuming the play is to confirm, by actual play, the life or death stones and the rights to the vacant points enclosed by the living stones. If one or both players find some contestable points on the board after two passes, as in (1) above, replay is forbidden and the points will be evenly divided between the two players.[/QUOTE] \ \ [go]$$W Hypothetical play \ $$ ----------------------- \ $$ | . . 2 1 B O O . \ $$ | X X . 4 3 X O . \ $$ | O X X X X X O . \ $$ | O O O O O O O . \ $$ | . . . . . . . .[/go] \ \ W5 fills. \ \ Suppose that after two passes White finds this play. I suppose that White and Black share the three points, 1, 3, 5. \ \ [go]$$W Seki? \ $$ ----------------------- \ $$ | a 3 5 1 X O O . \ $$ | X X 4 a 2 X O . \ $$ | O X X X X X O . \ $$ | O O O O O O O . \ $$ | . . . . . . . .[/go] \ \ But what if the players think that this is correct play? I suppose that White and Black share the 1, 3, and 5 points equally, but what about the 'a' points? Are they 3/4 Black and 1/4 White? Or does the referee say, no, this is not correct play, anyway? \ \ Anyway, the question of scoring the dame in a hypothetical seki remain, at least in cases where play is correct. And the question of the correctness of the hypothetical play also remains." "RobertJasiek","","2008-06-21 09:11:22","The rule has more problems, which I hope to address later. However, although the rule does create problems, they are NOT VERY severe because there is always the principle solution to just cancel that rule in a later rules revision because of its missing clarity, unambiguity, and logic. The rules work without that rule, as the Simplified WMSG Rules demonstrate." "RobertJasiek","","2008-06-23 06:49:55","There is are also the Simplified World Mind Sports Games Rules: \ \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/swmsg.html[/url] \ \ Here is a first but already detailed commentary on the rule text of the World Mind Sports Games Rules: \ \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/wmsgc.html[/url] \ \ Commentaries on strategy will have to be written later. \ \ Bill, you might particularly enjoy the section about contestable points." "RobertJasiek","","2008-07-17 00:46:29","There are some revisions: \ \ Official webpages: \ \ Link to all new announcements: \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/wmsg_members_documents.html[/url] \ \ WMSG Go Rules 2008-07-15 \ English \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/members_documents/2008_July_16/WMSG-GoRules_Revised.pdf[/url] \ Chinese \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/members_documents/2008_June_13/WMSG_rules%28C%29/WMSG-WeiqiRule.pdf[/url] \ \ WMSG Go Rules Appendix 1 2008-07-16 \ English \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/members_documents/2008_July_16/WMSG-GoRule-Appendix1_Revised.pdf[/url] \ Chinese \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/members_documents/2008_June_13/WMSG_rules%28C%29/WMSG-WeiqiRule-Appendix1.pdf[/url] \ \ WMSG Go Rules Appendix 2 2008-07-16 \ English \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/members_documents/2008_July_16/WMSG-GoRule-Appendix2_Revised.pdf[/url] \ Chinese \ [url]http://intergofed.org/wmsg/members_documents/2008_June_13/WMSG_rules%28C%29/WMSG-WeiqiRule-Appendix2.pdf[/url] \ \ The same and more from my webpages: \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/rules.html[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/swmsg.html[/url] // unofficial \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/wmsgc.html[/url] // warning: outdated \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/wmsgs.pdf[/url] // unofficial \ \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/turrules.html[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGrules3.pdf[/url] \ [url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/WMSGpair.pdf[/url]" "RobertJasiek","","2008-07-17 08:10:14","[url]http://home.snafu.de/jasiek/wmsgc.html[/url] \ \ is updated to reflect the changes of the original rules text of the \ World Mind Sports Games 2008 Rules in their version of 2008-07-15. The commentary is structured for players, referees, and experts." "RobertJasiek","","2008-09-13 04:10:11","WMSG participants and rules experts might wish to read news on rec.games.go."